Bitcoin is a LAND GRAB for Sats & is El Salvador really free? - Surfer Jim

Are bitcoiners guilty of their own idolization and echo chambers? Did Bitcoin make El Salvador free or was it something else?

Apr 19, 2024

Bitcoin is a LAND GRAB for Sats & is El Salvador really free? - Surfer Jim

Playable Characters Show Ep043

Presented by Bitcoin Trading Cards - https://btc-tc.com

Summary:

In this conversation, Jim and I discuss challenges of widespread adoption of Bitcoin, critical thinking in the Bitcoin space, challenges of finding the truth in a world filled with misinformation and fake narratives. He emphasizes the importance of individuals controlling their own Bitcoin and the need for a change in incentives at every level of society. Jim also expresses his opinions on Bukele and El Salvador and the need for individuals to continually check their own echo chambers and question the narratives they are presented with.

Timestamps:

00:00 The Value of Giving

06:00 Jim’s Career Leading to Bitcoin

12:00 Importance of Wisdom & Experience

14:30 Bitcoin Versus Real Estate

20:18 Pompliano & Grifters

25:40 Why Some Keep Pushing Scams

31:30 Why Lack of Total Global Bitcoin Adoption

33:21 The Challenges of Finding the Truth

34:30 Hippie Bubble Bursting Changes the World

36:20 Are Bitcoiners Naive?

40:00 Individuals Will Fix World, NOT This…

41:50 El Salvador, Bukele, & Is Freedom Real There?

43:42 Skepticism Towards Governments in Bitcoin

48:00 Bitcoin Echo Chambers

49:30 Do Citizens Benefit if Government Holds BTC?

50:30 Jim is IN Bitcoin Trading Cards!

51:50 Why Jim Is Ok With Standing For Truth

55:30 How Jim’s Work is Changing the World

59:59 The EndGAME

Bio of Jim:

OMAD Carnivore. ₿itcoin not blockchain. Lifelong surfer & entrepreneur.

Connect with Jim here:

Twitter - https://x.com/surferjimw

Article - https://citadel21.com/bitcoin-as-real-estate

Help from Jim - surferjim@thebitcoinadviser.com

Transcription:

Brandon Gentile (01:38.608)

Surfer Jim, thank you so much for joining me today, being a playable character in the sea of non-playable characters. So I know we're coming a little bit remote, you are on the road, but we're gonna talk about freedom, a little bit of freedom today and making sure we're living up to our own standards. So thank you for joining me today, sir.

Jim (01:56.838)

Hey, thanks for the invite. You know, if it's about Bitcoin, I could talk all day. So what do you got?

Brandon Gentile (02:05.64)

We know Jim's here. So I guess, you know, right there, you're at every conference. I mean, you just came back from El Salvador, which we'll talk about in a minute. You're now in Dallas for Bit Block Boom. You are all over the place. You're volunteering all the time. You're always helping out. Your heart's the size of a Mack truck of VJ Dictor's rig he drives around. It's that big. Where does the generosity come from?

Jim (02:24.378)

No. That's very kind of you.

Jim (02:31.074)

Oh, okay, it's totally self-serving. I'm just trying to get ahead and I figure if I volunteer a little. Now, it comes, actually, you know, there's a little bit of truth to that. I can't deny figuring that, well, if I help people, maybe, you know, I don't look for anything and I'm not keeping score, but it is how it works. If you go out of your way to help somebody, they may go out of their way to help you one day and you don't know when it's gonna come back and you don't keep score. You let the universe work it out.

I just have a passion for certain things and I hate to see people struggling. I've been to conferences enough times, come in a little early. I go check out the, you know, where is it going to be held? I see people running around, cleaning up, fixing up, doing things. I'm like, well, I got nothing to do. The thing starts tomorrow. Let me see if I can help. That's how it started. And you meet people little by little and, you know, one guy offers this, that or the other thing. And there was a point where Gary said to me...

You know, Jim, I could really use a guy like you. I feel like I don't have time to talk to people because I'm running around trying to keep everything on schedule and boy, if I had a guy like you around, I guess he, I don't know, again, I helped out enough. Maybe he could see my work ethic. I'm not quite sure, but he asked me if I'd be willing to help. I come to the thing for free, so that's a big expense I don't have to pay for. I still pay for my hotel and my airline flights, but.

It's a decent trade-off because so much of the time at these events is a social aspect. I mean, if I got to work for eight hours during a conference day, the rest of the time I'm here, days ahead and days behind that, it's all free hanging out with all my friends. So to me, it's a small price to pay. And honestly, it's not hard work. I've volunteered at Pacific Bitcoin two years in a row. I've worked at Unconfiscatable, a bunch of different years, various stuff. This will be my second year working at Bitblock Boom.

I actually last year after I did it I said to people and I even felt I felt this way that my conference experience was Enhanced I was running around he asked me to coordinate all the speakers That's kind of an interesting job. I have to they all have to interact with me. I have to have conversations with them I got to run around constantly looking for them asking people. Hey, have you seen this guy or that guy? So my

Jim (04:57.246)

My forced interaction was directed by the goal I was trying to resolve to find something. I had to find people I had never met before and wasn't even sure what they looked like. So that was a little bit of a challenge, but it was fun. It was like a kind of fun thing. I actually, so this is a little side weird side story. So my friend Xfrog who runs the audio here, he gave me a portable loudspeaker and a microphone and I took it out in the lobby.

and I started using it to usher people back into the room when after a break and I'd be like, yo folks, let's not have an empty room for the next speaker. Come on, get out of here, get back in the room. And people would laugh at me, but I had fun doing it. I felt like I'm a little in charge. Let me flex my power here like a politician. No, my experience was enhanced by it, right? It really was, I had fun doing it, so it didn't feel like work.

And so I'm like, yeah, might as well keep doing this stuff. So long answer to a short question, sorry.

Brandon Gentile (06:00.836)

No, and you do, I mean, you've got a good personality for it. It's like some people don't have the personality for that. Like where you have, you're just kind of a leader by nature. You kind of have that. People kind of listen to what you say and it's just some people have it, some people don't. So that's, people can tell. You mean what you're saying. So it's very, very cool that you do that. And I know everyone loves seeing you. And I'm sure I know all the conferences love you helping out and like you said, taking control and doing stuff. So we all appreciate it.

lucky to have you. I was just gonna ask you to build a great segue because I was just gonna ask, you know, entrepreneur, surfer, and I want you to elaborate on that because I don't know if many people know exactly what you do to be totally honest. I think they just think you surf all day long, Jim.

Jim (06:31.874)

Do you know what I do for a living?

Jim (06:40.011)

Yeah, yeah.

Jim (06:47.619)

I wish I could maybe one day I am gonna be in my 50th year of surfing this year and Never thought of myself as an entrepreneur, but I guess I fit the description I started my own construction company 35 years ago. And so I have to be a leader If I'm not in charge Nothing's getting done. So you learn to lead you learn to lead in a respectful way so that the people you're trying to lead

I believe that interactions between people should always be voluntary. And if you're going to have workers, you want them to come and actually volunteer their best effort. So you have to create conditions that they actually want to. And it's a challenge. You know, I'm trying to run a profitable business. So you know, it's not good if I lose money. And it's not good if I lose workers because I give them crappy conditions to work under or

broken down tools or whatever. So if you're gonna be a leader, you gotta know all the right elements, I guess. And it's worked out pretty good. And I've also recognized that I'm a teacher. It took me a while to really accept that, but I have to constantly teach different workers, subcontractors, my customers, and even my suppliers to help me solve the problems that are

whatever the whatever the job uh, whatever's involved in the job, um, just as a quick aside, uh, a very unique job i'm doing right now where we took a house, a one-story house, we picked it up 20 feet in the air and we built the first floor under it and put it on top. That's not a common job and it's the average person wouldn't even know where to start and I have a good amount of experience lifting houses. I actually used to have a house lifting company.

for many years and I've lifted dozens of houses and they're all different and you know, there's a whole procedure to it but coordinating it all, nobody on my crew would know what to do so I have to lead but I also have to you know, be able to anticipate and put out fires because no job goes perfect. There's always something that you didn't anticipate or whatever.

Jim (09:06.562)

So it's a lot involved, but I found myself being a teacher over the years and I guess that's where I found myself in Bitcoin. And I will say this too, and I've said this on many podcasts, when I was a kid growing up, I had a natural curiosity to wanna know how things worked inside. And I grew up in an analog world, there wasn't a lot of digital of anything. So I would take my record player apart or the cake mixer that was broken that my mother threw in the garbage and I yelled at her for throwing it away because I wanna see inside of it.

So I took Bitcoin apart, like on a technical level, as much as I could, because I, well, my third touch learning about Bitcoin was a woman on a TED Talk who said, you could trust the Bitcoin protocol without trusting the people in it. And I had to find out what that meant, because my entire business is built on trust. I've never had a website, I've never advertised. I've been steady busy for 35 years because my customers love me and they recommend me all the time. So I had to take Bitcoin apart from a mental technical point of view.

so that I could understand the working parts inside so that I could decide if I really could trust it. And you know, trying to understand that statement that woman made. So I spent six months and I spent six months watching the price triple in 2017 before I bought any because I couldn't, I didn't know. Scammy internet money, what about, you know. But once I understood the technical angle, it was very clear to me how it worked. And I don't think most people take that.

Brandon Gentile (10:25.414)

Right.

Jim (10:33.718)

that course to try to understand, but I did and it made all the difference because as soon as I could understand it, I could then articulate it to other people who were misled or confused about what a blockchain is or whatever. And I'm still constantly pushing back on people who definitely really don't understand it, but they just think they do. And it's, you know, whatever it is, what it is. I'm doing the best I can to put out truthful signal. And I tell everybody, do not trust me.

If you're listening to this right now, do not trust me, Brandon, anybody else, go out and verify. We say it in Bitcoin all the time, don't trust verify. And so, you know, hopefully if I'm wrong, somebody will call me out on it and I will humbly apologize, hopefully. I'd like to think I would. So yeah, it's a crazy wild ride. But anyway, I don't wanna direct this whole conversation. I'll let you continue whatever questions you brought.

Brandon Gentile (11:29.352)

I was telling you offline, I could listen to you for hours. You are a teacher, I can confirm that. A lot of time listening to Jim talk on spaces, just spending time together on spaces in the digital world for the last few years, and you are, you're a great teacher and you know your history, you have a lot of wisdom and experience, which is something that, it's not, there's not a ton of wisdom and experience in the Bitcoin world in the sense that there's a lot of younger people, right?

Jim (11:33.711)

Oh, that's very generous.

Brandon Gentile (11:59.066)

just by that very nature, you're not going to have a limitless experience, life experience. So that's why I think people like you, Larry Lappard's, the David Foley's, you know, about the Bob Burnett's, there's so many of you, or I shouldn't say so many, there are a fair amount of you that I think are we be wise to heed what you say and listen to you very carefully because I think those are the people, again, as you know, Bitcoin is a humility test, not an IQ test.

Jim (12:26.872)

Yeah.

Brandon Gentile (12:29.246)

your life for whatever 50, 60, 70, 80 years and then be able to say you know what maybe there is a different way that's the epitome of humility and I just think you have it in spades some of you guys have been spades that's why I love listening some of you guys talk and teach

Jim (12:42.978)

Well, that's super generous of you and I really appreciate it. And I just want to bring as much truth to this discussion as possible. And I've now found that, well, I've decided this is kind of like my mission for the rest of my life here. I think Bitcoin is too important not to tell the whole world about and to the extent that someone hears my voice and they might stop and think about it and maybe it changes their life, then I've done my job, so to speak.

And oddly enough on the plane from El Salvador up to Dallas, I sat next to a Spanish woman and her son who spoke good enough English that we had a really long conversation about Bitcoin and guaranteed they are going home and they're doing their homework because they asked a lot of great questions and I answered them and they went, really? Oh, I didn't know that. I know over and over again. So and that was like I didn't see that coming. But they want they asked me the questions. I'll answer them all day long. So it was pretty cool.

Brandon Gentile (14:06.343)

That is

Brandon Gentile (14:11.006)

It gets talked about here and there. I don't think enough really. I mean, yes, some people you've written about it. I know I've seen a few people write about it over time for sure, but it is really interesting. Like real estate's looked at as kind of, you know, probably one of like the top things on the Fiat Titanic. Like it's like the biggest thing you can do in that Fiat world and then Fiat matrix is the hardest, maybe the most experienced, you know, you can infinite returns. Like, you know, I did it for 10 years and not in your world, but helping people buy and sell, investing, raising money.

But you're still on the fiat Titanic and you're still going to end up 12,000 feet under the Atlantic, you know And so Bitcoin being that life raft a new monetary system Could you elaborate on that article that you wrote in Citadel 21 and just your kind of the way you look at real estate versus Bitcoin

Jim (14:58.606)

Sure, so I have to give credit to a man who has basically disappeared from the Bitcoin space, Trace Mayer, anybody who was around a bunch of years ago, he was a very influential, very smart man, and I learned a lot from him. But he went out with a reputation of a scammer a couple of years ago. I'll let people do their own research. But he said the words of Bitcoin, you know, get yourself some Bitcoin real estate or something offhanded.

And he may have sort of done the analogy that, uh-oh, I see the word reconnecting on my screen. All right, we didn't get interrupted, did we?

Brandon Gentile (15:44.576)

going haywire. Yeah, I can hear you.

Jim (15:51.806)

again. All right. All right. Hopefully you can edit that stuff. So all right. Good. So all right. So after I heard Trace Mayor sort of compare Bitcoin to real estate, I thought, wow, that's a really cool analogy. And first thing I did was I did a tweet thread. And then I and then I saw I think I saw a request for articles for Citadel 21. And I was

Brandon Gentile (15:55.779)

Yeah, we're good.

Jim (16:19.282)

following HODL not and he was following me. So I, you know, we were friendly on Twitter and I'm the writer, honestly. Well, I write contracts all the time for my business and I write tons of emails. So I can write, but I'd never consider myself a writer. But I decided to take my tweet thread and expand it into an article. But what I did was I went out and did some research, you know, internet research. I wanted to see how many people were on the planet.

how many acres of land were on the planet. I started to realize that, well, a lot of land is completely unusable for living. You're not living, most people aren't living on mountain peaks or in swamps. And so there's only so much usable land. And of that, a lot of it's used for farming. So then again, you cut down to the amount of livable land. And I thought, well, how much land would each person get if you chopped it up and gave a piece to every person on the planet, eight billion people. And I think the number was like,

around 2 acres, 1.8 acres, and that seemed like a lot. I mean, I grew up on a quarter acre of land and it seemed like big enough and some people live on way smaller than that. And, of course, Bitcoin is limited, right? So I did the math and I said, okay, 21 million Bitcoin, how many are lost? Let's say 3, 4 million are lost, whatever. Came down to maybe, I think I

Jim (17:45.37)

You know eight billion people and I think it comes out to 235,000 61 sats per person or some weird number like that and I thought okay. Well, how does that all play out? How does that work out? How does that compare and I just did a couple of comparisons It's an easy 10-minute read you can get it off my Twitter profile But in the end at the time when I wrote the article, I want to say 2019

If you were to call it your fair share of Bitcoin, equally divided by everybody, 200 and some odd thousand Sats, it was like nine bucks or 10 bucks to get that amount. Then I said, well, what if Bitcoin was $10,000? Well, it was maybe a hundred bucks then, or whatever it was. It was like easy numbers. Even at a million dollars per Bitcoin, I think your fair share is like two grand. And I'm just like, man, if people only recognize that this is a land grab for Sats,

And you could get them really cheap. And I even wrote stuff like, you know, some people spend that much in beer every month. You know, like if you just diverted a little beer money, maybe you could have generational wealth or something, you know. So I made it as clear as possible. Like Bitcoin is not only cheap, you can get a lot of it before everybody else hears about it. And you know, it's scarce and it's likely to go up in value and you really ought to look at this. So, I mean, I got a lot of good feedback on that and it's there. And I...

What I really was attempting to do too was to write an article that would not have to change with the times. It wasn't about current events, wasn't about anything other than statistical numbers and the likely, I guess, tied to the likelihood Bitcoin's value is going to go up. And so you could read this article 20 years from now and nothing about it will be untrue. So I kind of like that. So should stand the test of time. My only real article I've ever written. So there you go.

Brandon Gentile (19:42.876)

Well, it's really good. And it's a great read. I'll link to it in here and everyone should check it out. Because it's again, like, as we as people go down the Bitcoin rabbit hole, I mean, just you keep tapping into things that keeps like chase changing your context, right keeps reframing things and how you see the world and it really is Process where you're changing right in it. So in a couple minutes, again, we'll talk about

Jim (19:57.908)

Oh yeah, totally.

Jim (20:04.054)

Yeah, yeah, it's pretty interesting. The more you know, the more you realize you don't know. And you're in the rabbit hole going down corridor after corridor. There's no end to all of them. You back out, you go down another corridor. It's like, wow, this just never ends. It's pretty wild.

Brandon Gentile (20:20.236)

It's wild. In a minute, we will talk about some, you know, a little bit of El Salvador and Bitcoiners in their own echo chamber. But I would like for you to talk about Bitcoin. You just mentioned a minute ago Bitcoin and not crypto and the difference between the two. Like Anthony Pompignano just had a tweet earlier about some, you know, like HR, you know, crypto, HR thing, handling companies and their stakeholders. And so he's getting shredded by Bitcoiners and then he's crying about it and stuff.

had tweeted it back and I was just like, bro, like you, you know, the problem, like, you know, you have a huge, you have a huge platform, you have a huge following. And we need to build this world on monetary rock. And then you can play games, then you can talk about tokenization and all kinds, whatever you want to do after that. What Why is it in your mind? Like, why can't people see that we need to we can't put this cart before the horse, we're constantly doing this and trying to recreate these fiat games before we have the monetary rock and building a house, real estate on that monetary rock. Like, why is this

Jim (21:00.182)

Uh oh, you're breaking up. Your connection is horrible.

Jim (21:24.602)

Yeah, well, unfortunately, Pomp leon is a grifter. He latches on to every, you know, the narrative of the day. I saw a big tweet he put out about blockchain and he clearly has no idea how Bitcoin actually works. So I skewered him. I responded to a couple of his tweets and I wrote still clueless, but at least you're consistent stuff like that because he's an idiot.

I mean, he's not an idiot. He knows a lot of stuff, but he is not in it for Bitcoin, for black market freedom money. He's in it for fiat gains. He's in it for the popularity. He likes his notoriety. He jumps on whatever the bandwagon is of today. It's sad because it's easy to do. There's always new people coming in.

They're easy to fool. There's too much information. There's way too much noise that's drowning out the real signal. And Anthony's part of the noise, unfortunately. And yet he'll go on CNBC and he'll promote just Bitcoin because that's the subject matter. And he looks like a Bitcoiner when you watch him there. But, and he's right. I mean, I've listened to many interviews and he's, in my opinion, truthfully answered relevant information.

Questions about Bitcoin in the same way I might but on his own podcast in his tweet threads and stuff like that I'm a little surprised. He hasn't blocked me by now Because I I'm always pushing back on his grifting Oddly enough He he kind of offered to interview me once because I told him I could teach him all about it and but it never happened, I think I think he was just Just playing with me or something, whatever

We'll see. But anyway, I don't know if I answered your question correctly. Unfortunately, there's a lot of misinformation and it's up to people that understand it to straighten out that information. The idea of a proof of work blockchain that Bitcoin is has only one use. In my opinion, I like to summarize it by saying a proof of work blockchain does essentially two things. It creates within itself, digital files,

Jim (23:45.658)

we call them coins or in Bitcoin's case, we call them Bitcoins. It creates them and then it tracks them. And it, oh, every single Bitcoin stays within the system. People talk about their Bitcoin on their hardware wallet. That's not how that works. Your Bitcoin is always within the system. It's just whether or not you have access to it through your wallet. And people just don't, they don't understand the nuances of how that actually works or what it means is there's just a lot of that going on, unfortunately. And yeah, so I'm, I'm hoping that

you know, for the people that are really curious and open-minded and are willing to change their opinion, if they talk to me long enough, I think I could teach them how this works. I don't think to go back for a second about that whole blockchain and why I pushed back against his tweet, there's a lot of rhetoric about this. The guy Larry Fink from BlackRock thinks they're going to tokenize the world. And literally...

There's zero reason to put things like stocks.

Jim (25:00.972)

I can say that I'm going to sell it to you, but the county where the house sits and the tax collection people aren't necessarily going to agree that you now own the house. And so because it's a physical item on the planet somewhere, there becomes physical enforcement of stuff. And so anything outside the confines of the blockchain, really Bitcoin.

is a time chain. Blockchain was never even used in the white paper. But within the protocol, you can enforce the rules. But if you're going to tie one of these tokens, coins, digital files to the outside world, you need a third party trust model. And that completely destroys the whole premise of permissionless and immutable. Right? So,

The proof of work blockchain that Bitcoin represents is a, I like to use this description. Bitcoin is self-propagating. It grows itself. Nobody makes it grow. The protocol allows it to grow and it grows at a very specific rate. So it's self-propagating. It's self-regulating. The protocol verifies itself. Nobody could stop it. So it's doing this automatically. And what's really interesting is it's...

self-regulating. It actually speeds itself up and slows itself down.

Jim (26:42.685)

So this idea that you could put stuff on the blockchain is absurd because the protocol only allows for all the characteristics, the verifiability and the immutability within itself. It cannot do anything with the outside world. That's where you have to have a trusted third party to make the connection. And then you don't need a blockchain, you might as well have a database. And so Larry Fink is a bonehead.

Anybody who thinks blockchain is the next big thing is an idiot bonehead. It's never going to happen. If it does, it's going to be fake and manipulated and you're never going to get the immutable characteristics of Bitcoin. And it's the same thing with all the idiot ordinals people out there and the NFTs idiots that think you can do all this stuff on blockchain and all of a sudden you can own a JPEG. It blows my mind that so many people fall for this stuff, but they're out there. They don't know the technology. They don't take the time to learn it.

And they're all trying to get rich quick, and most of them get scammed. And sadly, this is the worst part, there are plenty of people who know this, and they promote the idea that it is true because they are the scammers. Udi is one of them, David Bailey's another one, Eric Wall's another one, there's a lot of them out there. And they're getting away with it, and they're making tons of money because there's new people constantly coming in, and they're gonna get taken because it's easy. It's like shooting fish in a barrel.

Brandon Gentile (28:08.88)

Do you think like what you know, because you we they have to know what Bitcoin is like you said with pump I mean, he's a smart guy that he knows Bitcoin like why is it just grifters are gonna grift like They do know that the new system is available and it's there we just pushed forward You know that as Breitbart said politics is downstream from culture We have enough people a couple percent of the population says bitcoins the new standard then guess what bitcoins a new standard And then all the wealth you could ever imagine really for humanity is there for the taking why?

Why is it that people just continually shuffle these deckchairs on the Titanic? Like all these people you just mentioned. I don't get that at all.

Jim (28:45.625)

The only thing I could think of is they're not getting rich enough quick enough and they found a way to accumulate more fiat money and then they may turn it into Bitcoin if they really realize. Honestly, with a guy like Pompidiano, I bet if you asked him, technically, how does the Bitcoin time chain work? I don't think he could tell you. I've never heard him describe it in any sort of... So I believe I could be wrong, but a lot of people have complimented me on this. I believe I can explain it, how it technically works in layman's terms.

And that is my whole reasoning for wanting to help teach this stuff because it is technically hard in many ways. But at the same time, you can take a technical subject and break it down and explain it to anybody, especially if you can use a good analogy or a metaphor that allows them to visualize something. And I've never heard Pompeano ever, ever describe how Bitcoin works so people could understand it. No, he just, you know, all about the hype.

the hype cycles, the ICOs, all the crap we've been seeing for many, many years. I've only been in this space for, I started studying a little over eight years ago, so about seven years full time, and it didn't take me long to figure it out. And as soon as I did, it was really clear where all the scammy stuff was, because you just gotta listen to people. You could tell they don't know what they're talking about, and they're just pumping some bags that they wanna get rich, fiat rich. It's really sad, but it's human nature. It's to be expected.

And when you're, when you have an open protocol like this, you can't stop people from doing stuff. That's one of the reasons why Bitcoin matters is because it's free and open source and no one could stop you from joining and no one could kick you off. That's really important. But because it's free and open source, the only way anybody could trust it is the code had to be completely transparent. And that's what allowed a lot of people to go copy it and then tweak it a little and call it the better Bitcoin or Solano.

other crap, even Ethereum is the biggest joke and Vitalik Buterin, he's another grifter. He should know better. He seems smart enough even though he's a little strange to me, but whatever. I don't dislike the guy personally. I just think he's a liar like so many other people and he's made a shit ton of money. Can I say that? Sorry. He's made a lot of money. He got in Bitcoin early. He's probably got a bunch of Bitcoin, but he also...

Jim (31:07.345)

promoted eat at a point where you know he made a lot of money doing that a lot you know i say a lot of money i even hate to use that term because what is money you know uh... this lots of forms of what people think is money in this world but real money is has the characteristics of the court to meet because the only real money everything else is essentially fake money but it's money people value it uh... you know values objective uh... and so if you want to value yen or pounds or dollars you know people do

and they're able to buy and sell things using these inferior forms of money. But most people don't see Bitcoin as the ultimate money. They see it as a stepping stone to get more of whatever money they think is the money they should have, a lot of it's US dollars. But you know, I think society will learn over a long enough period of time that this is the right answer. And I have a, what's the right word? A hesitant.

I'm hesitant to want to say this, but I feel like there's a high likelihood that Bitcoin might be inevitable. I actually did a talk, the title was Bitcoin is Inevitable, but since that I've learned a lot more and it could possibly break. I hate to even say that because I am a really big believer that Bitcoin is old enough and strong enough now that no one could stop it. And so I can't see a way for it to break, but I don't know.

And so I would like to think that it's inevitable in the sense that if it never stops Little by little by little every single human being will recognize this is good for me I say this all the time to Bitcoin is incentivized for individuals not groups. And so when I hear people wanting to Encourage governments to acquire Bitcoin. I see no real direct value to the citizens in that regard

If you're gonna take Bitcoin and back fiat currency with it, yeah, okay, I see the logic. The problem is you can verify all the Bitcoin, you can't verify all that's pegged to it. And so that doesn't really fly. So I don't know, there's, like this whole thing, there's so much, so many angles, there's so many side doors to go through to figure all this out. I'm just trying my best over here.

Jim (33:31.869)

I forget what the original question was. I hope I didn't go too off on a tangent there.

Brandon Gentile (33:35.532)

No, it was, yeah, it was brilliant. I mean, we started with just some of the bitcoins, not crypto, right? And just the differences. And you had a great explanation of the grifters, and why they might grift, because it's something I've been thinking about for a while, but you really hit it with, whether it's they just want to scam because they want more fiat, or maybe they're scamming people to get more Bitcoin, that there could be multiple explanations or both, or there could be many all at once at play. So really, really well said. What...

Jim (33:58.)

Yeah.

Jim (34:04.716)

Thanks.

Brandon Gentile (34:08.756)

like at this point, I feel like there's a lot of Bitcoiners that are kind of like, how do people not see this? You know, we all forget our own story, right? And us getting over that hurdle, but with inflation and lockdowns and Russia, you know, assets getting frozen, well, shouldn't say assets, dollar liabilities, like all these things getting frozen, like how do people at this point, you know, the last four years, how is 50% of the world not seeing Bitcoin for what it is? What are, what are, what are Jim's thoughts on, on why?

Jim (34:18.248)

Yeah.

Brandon Gentile (34:38.63)

people why we're still such little real adoption I guess at this point.

Jim (34:42.909)

television.

Jim (34:46.769)

They're all slaves to the man on the TV. They just do what he says. Honestly, it's the propaganda, it's the indoctrination of years and years of believing the government's looking out for you, believing Anthony Fauci wants you to stay alive and healthy. I mean, this is so much insanity that's pushed out through the idiot box in the living room. And people, you know, look, I spent most of my life with the television and believing much of what I saw on it.

Unfortunately, well, or fortunately for me, I finally woke up. I haven't owned a TV in probably at least five years. And I have no interest to anything that's on there because I don't believe any of it's in our best interest. It's in the best interest of the advertisers and the media people and, you know, whatever, you know, they're making their profits. They'll tell you whatever they need to do if they can make profits. And that's really sad. There's a high lack of integrity in.

in media, politics, and a lot of corporate, a lot of the corporate world, because when you're in those realms with, and you're high enough up.

you have access to advantages other people don't have. And I'm trying to say this as generically as possible, but if you wanna play at that level, that's what it is. You have to play a game that was built before you got there and a lot of it requires you to compromise your integrity, unfortunately. And I wouldn't be surprised if most politicians and a lot of business leaders.

get lured into compromising themselves in various ways, including going visiting Epsi Island, right, which we'll probably never see because half the FBI probably went there and they're going to implicate themselves if they let us see his diary or whatever. I mean, it's such a joke. And yeah, it's hard to find the truth.

Jim (36:45.057)

It's really hard to find the truth. And when you hear about magic internet money and it fixes the world, you go like, yeah, right. You guys are nuts. So it's, I don't know. I don't know what else to do. I will say this though. I've said this for quite a while. I don't know if I'll be right. It may, may play out way longer than this, or I mean, to see it. But, um, I think the hyper Bitcoin ization or Bitcoin being a predominant world currency is a two generational thing from where we are.

That is, a lot of the existing older generation, actually people in my age category, boomers and older, that many of them still control out of wealth and narratives and businesses and politics in this world. They've got to die. They're going to die anyway. But it's when they die and their philosophy and their influence goes away that it can be replaced by somebody new. And in the middle you'll have a bunch of people that don't know where to go, younger politicians that don't know where to go.

are falling for their older counterparts, what they tell them, or becoming so entrenched, becoming compromised that they have to continue to tell the bullshit line that they're being told. But then you're going to have a generation of young kids growing up in Bitcoin families with solid parents that are going to home school and they're going to teach them the truth. And that can't be stopped. And

with a long enough period of time, I think humanity heals, I think the world heals, I think wars go away, I think governments shrink down to the most localist level and communities the world over begin to trade in love and cooperation. And I hope I get to see that world, and if not me, maybe my heirs will get to see it, but if I can help bring that about, then I'll think that my life was totally well worth living.

I'll consider it the reason I was meant to be here maybe, so we'll see.

Brandon Gentile (38:43.42)

I couldn't agree more. That's why we're talking offline. I mean, we, I always resonate with what you say because I, I couldn't not agree more. Do you think the only pushback that I, when you talk like that, I get this pushback is I'll talk a similar way and the pushback I'll get is, you know, that's a pretty optimistic. That's a pretty, you know, a utopian view. Like you think Pee-winters is going to change and this and that and blah, you know, people tend to be more cynical, right? Maybe entrepreneurs tend to be more, more optimistic.

more idealistic maybe? I mean, do you think that there's something to that? Or I mean, I think we're right, but is there something that we're missing? Like have you ever gone down those rabbit holes of like, hey, what am I missing? I'm sure you have, what are your thoughts on that?

Jim (39:26.489)

Well, I think, so I think I said this a minute ago, Bitcoin is optimized or is incentivized for individuals and not groups. So governments holding Bitcoin, unless they spend it on their citizens, the citizens don't benefit by that group of people controlling Bitcoin. But people controlling their own Bitcoin, essentially their own money and being able to do it in a sovereign way, not having it be confiscatable by some government, that

that change it. So two things, the feeling of sovereignty is really powerful, but the understanding that there's a limited supply and you can't get any more without providing some value to somebody else who has to voluntarily give you that money, that changes the game dramatically. So if you're a politician, you're a central banker, and you don't have the ability to just make money or manipulate markets with...

magic words on paper that give benefits to one corporation over another because they're going to because a lot of money is going to go to them and they're going to they're going to finance your next campaign. Well the incentives at every level change. The people who are paying for campaigns they're not going to want to spend their Bitcoin unless they're really sure of the candidate and the process. The candidates having to collect Bitcoin for their campaign.

They're not going to just want to waste it. They're going to be very selective where they spend it. Every single individual is going to lower their time preference and cheap Chinese crap is going to disappear. And you're going to see high quality everything, because nobody's going to buy junk anymore. Or at least if they do, they know they're buying junk and it's temporary. And maybe there'll be a small portion of society that still, you know, waste their money because they're stupid, whatever. But when, when the

when the monetary units are restricted and the only thing that can change are its value, people are going to treat it differently and they're going to act differently. I honestly think, well, I've seen it in my own life and I've seen it in every Bitcoiner I know. Everybody is changed by Bitcoin. You are changed in many ways, but the other thing I've noticed is, and I know this for myself, is I've always been a Bitcoiner and then I found Bitcoin.

Jim (41:48.109)

And I knew I had to align with it because it aligns with my values. It aligns with honesty and integrity and truth. And a lot of people want to live that way and they find it hard in a fiat world that cheats all around them. And it's very easy to join and cheat because everybody else is doing it. I mean, it's everywhere. And then if you're cheating along with the other people who are also cheating, you're accepted. You're all pals. But how is your...

How is your heart? How is your integrity? How's your relationship with God if you believe in that kind of stuff? And so I think when there is no way to have that fake monetary system and manipulate people through the creation and distribution of money, I think everybody's incentive at every level changes and collectively society just heals. Now, there's a lot of ways you can evaluate at what ways, how fast, what directions.

I just think it starts with every individual one at a time and when enough individuals are in the same place at the same time collectively as groups they can make changes. And so I feel like the Bitcoin revolution is a ground up revolution. It's not going to start at governments. Governments accumulating Bitcoin are not going to fix the world. Individuals accumulating Bitcoin are going to grow up and fix government and fix industry. And that's why I say it's going to take a couple of generations depending on how long you count a generation that could be.

30 to 50 years, 60 years, I don't know what's an average generation necessarily, but it could be quite a ways off. By then the value of Bitcoin could be worth a billion dollars and that's going to change the game, but it's certainly going to send a signal to anybody out there who hasn't been paying attention yet. This is the money everybody else wants to use and at some point no one's going to take fiat money for it anymore. They're only going to take goods and services. And that's the world where Bitcoin really has won.

You know, so hopefully I get to see it, but if I don't, I'm still going to fight for it.

Brandon Gentile (43:47.532)

Love it. Well said.

turning towards El Salvador. So you were just there and you set off a little firestorm on Twitter or whatever you wanna call it. And you're breaking everyone's echo chambers and that's where I wanna kind of touch on that with you and this importance of continually checking ourselves and living up to the memes, living up to our own adages and what we preach and we're human,

Jim (44:01.25)

Little?

Brandon Gentile (44:21.39)

chambers but how important is it to continually check these echo chambers and the mental frameworks that you operate by and again we talked about your frameworks and how you've lived your entire life like you just said you know you were a bitcoin before there was even a bitcoin right and you just aligned and that's why bitcoin became just inevitable for you um why is it so important to continually check yourself and your echo chambers and question things when it could be anything

Jim (44:44.335)

Uh oh, you-

Jim (44:58.141)

Okay, so the connection's a little rough. I missed a few of your words, but yes, I was in El Salvador at the having party and I got my little water bottle here. I'm gonna take a sip.

And I just have to say that was an incredible event. The meme factory, Big Sean Harris, did such an incredible job. The people that went were awesome, solid Bitcoiners. And you mentioned, I don't know the words you used, I started a shitstorm on Twitter about El Salvador. I went down there, I really enjoyed myself. I loved El Salvador, I loved the people, I loved the energy down there. But there's a lot of fake narratives going on around that.

around that country and I pushed back on a tweet that I saw from the president and that kind of kicked it off because it's portrayed as utopia down there. You know everything's fixed because Bitcoin and it's not. The government, what's a government? Government is just other people. That's it.

They shit themselves in diapers just like me and you. Now they have control of vast amounts of resources and armies to point guns at us. They're just other people. They have no natural right to tell us.

Jim (46:33.956)

Probably I'm no longer friends with him. He probably doesn't like me because I pushed back on him. There's a video of him screaming like he loves to do about how free everybody is in El Salvador, which is incredibly so far from the truth, insanely so far from the truth. I had to push back. I've been on Twitter today probably five, six hours responding to the insane amounts of responses I got. How El Salvador is so much better because of Bitcoin. No.

El Salvador is better because a man who decided he likes Bitcoin cracked down in an authoritarian way and threw anybody with a tattoo on their face in jail. And I'm going to guess statistically there's a couple people that are innocent. And that doesn't fly with me. You know, I mean, hey, you can always say, well, look at the results. They justify the actions. Yeah, well, maybe less people are dying. They say, OK, fine. That's a good result. I get it.

But you can't sweep up innocent people and destroy their lives in the process. That's not fair to me. I don't think it's right and I certainly don't think it's any law that allows for that. But he literally just was playing dictator and just decided. And so a lot of people love him for that. And if I was an El Salvadorian afraid of gangs, I'd probably love him too.

I'm already living under his regime. He's already stealing my money through taxation. So he's already my enemy, technically. But he fixed the country a little, so he's made my life a little easier. OK, so I like him a little. I get it. He looks like a good guy. But he's still a politician. I don't believe he's in charge. El Salvador is not a big enough country with enough wealth. If he's going to get along with the rest of the world, he's going to have to bow down to greater powers than him. And

What started it for me was his tweet about he's going to bring 5,000 real smart people, you know, top of the top, best of the best engineers, whoever, and he's going to give them a free pass. No taxes, come in, bring your knowledge and your wealth to our country and we'll hook you up. And I just thought, damn, just screw your own citizens, keep stealing their money and give a break to a total stranger. Because why? Because he's bringing wealth to your country, he's making you look good. There is so much.

Jim (48:57.056)

in it for me versus in it for everybody else that politicians do, that I don't trust them one bit. And don't think for a second that one of those people out there in the world that wants to be among those 5,000, who's got some credentials, but maybe doesn't meet whatever standards they decide have to be met, but he's really rich.

I don't think for a moment that some people's status changes mysteriously when large contributions show up in personal bank accounts in just the right places. I mean, come on. You could pay for anything in this world. So are they going to let in 5,000 really deserving people? And who judges? Who's that out of 8 billion? Who really makes that judgment? Him and his cronies in the government, right? I don't know the...

full story but apparently one of the government officials that pushed back against corruption mysteriously died in jail recently. Boy that doesn't look good. That looks like super authoritarian you know whatever uh... you know murder your rivals in jail so they don't expose your corruption so I am just so suspect of all this stuff and there's way too many big corners that are in love with

the president or whatever, whatever. I mean, they're just people. They should not be put up on such a high pedestal. And so many people seem to be trusting and not verifying. And it's kind of sad for Bitcoiners. But I'm recognizing what's going on here. Bitcoin was born out of the cypherpunk revolution. These are people who hate government, who push back constantly, and were looking for ways to thwart their efforts. And Satoshi discovered

combination of technologies that might do it and he gave it to the world and The original the people who got the early Bitcoin as many of them understood that but many of them didn't but I was I was educated around Bitcoin With that ethos that this is free market money meant to equalize the playing field and Way too many Bitcoin is right now

Jim (51:08.108)

either haven't heard that or don't get that, don't get it at a deep enough level to recognize where it's being compromised. It's being compromised all over the place, especially when I hear Bitcoiners cheering for governments to adopt Bitcoin because it's going to fix things. There's no chance the US government adopting Bitcoin is going to change anything in this country. And I don't believe it's going to do anything for El Salvador either.

Jim (51:38.832)

the actions of people that might make a place better. And I'll say it again, I'll say it forever. Until a government spends the Bitcoin on its citizens, the citizens gain nothing, nothing. I don't see, tell me how they gain. If you and me and 10 other people get a bunch of Bitcoin, how does anybody who doesn't have control of that Bitcoin benefit because we have it? They don't.

They don't unless we give it to them or spend it on them. They get nothing out of it. So there's zero reason to incentivize governments to hold Bitcoin, zero in my opinion. Unless you're gonna peg currencies to it, but again, I said earlier, you can't. There's too many fiat units and they could still make more without telling anybody. So that's a joke, right? You can't peg money back, any fiat money back to gold like some gold bugs would have you believe. None of that's ever coming back. The only way this world heals is if Bitcoin is the only money. And that's a couple of generations at minimum away, unfortunately, but.

That's my perspective. Maybe history will prove me wrong. I have not heard a single person give me a reasonable argument as to why, when governments hold Bitcoin, the citizens benefit. Because nobody could think of one because I don't believe one exists. So if it's out there, anybody hears this, push back. Show me how a group of people that call themselves government, owning Bitcoin, benefits the citizens they're supposed to represent. I don't believe it exists.

Brandon Gentile (53:07.97)

Yeah, I

Brandon Gentile (53:32.402)

Change your culture, but also checking yourself continually checking yourself breaking your echo chambers slaying your heroes, right? We get so we like we just get so like so focused on like a person or two or a hero or two So yeah, well said well said checking yourself constantly. So In in wrapping here a little bit Bitcoin trading cards. We got a new here in a second word association But how you server gym is gonna be some flipping Bitcoin trading cards here at bit block

Jim (53:39.344)

Yeah.

Jim (53:48.316)

Thank you.

Jim (53:53.743)

Ah!

Brandon Gentile (54:02.002)

Boom coming up this week. They're dropping this week. Wild, wild, probably for rants like you.

Jim (54:06.744)

Yeah, tell me about it. It's surreal bro. It's surreal from my end like I'm gonna be on a trading card. How did that happen? It's crazy

Brandon Gentile (54:16.596)

uh... the country carter's is a pretty red pill or orange gold organization let's just say that so uh... allowed at the top leading it and uh... that's why so for jim that so uh... it's a testament to you and again what you just talked about cj and i mean like the stuff you just went through not easy to say for a lot of the corner a lot of one of them have been thought about a lot of them have been talked about it is some there don't even know honestly but it's just because the checking yourself you know and you just saying in thinking hey am i going right direction we do going the right direction what are

So that's the moral of that whole story. It's, it's, we don't know all the answers. None of us know all the answers, but it's just doing your homework. Like you said, trust would verify, right? Don't trust me. Go verify, go do your research. So, um, just so well said, um, in saying that.

Jim (55:00.796)

Listen, I want to just say something as to why I'm willing to be so toxic and take a position like this Because I'm old Kind of I mean I feel like I got plenty years left I think I honestly I've had relatives live to almost a hundred and several of them And so I got 30 maybe even 40 or more years So I got plenty of time that I can enjoy this life and perhaps do a lot of good But I've already lived 63 years on this planet and I've seen a lot of stuff

And I'm at this point where, you know, I don't really give a shit anymore. I don't give a shit if you don't like me or if you don't believe me, I'm just going to do what I'm going to do. I'll try not to get myself in trouble and thrown in jail by somebody who doesn't agree. But if, if somebody I admired decides they don't like me anymore because they don't agree with my position, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. They don't make my life. The people really close to me make my life and those are the people I really care about. So.

I care about Bitcoin, I care about humanity generally, and I care about doing something on this planet that helps push love and goodness and fairness in the world, if I can in any way. And I feel like, wow, I got this opportunity through this thing called Bitcoin to actually maybe make a difference on this planet. Wow, that's pretty amazing. I never thought I'd make much of a difference. I make a difference in the lives of the people I work for. I build beautiful homes, I renovate stuff. I mean, my customers seem to like me a lot. They keep hiring me.

It's not like I've done nothing on this planet, but it's a very small scale, very localized. I now have friends all over the world. It blows my mind. People from all over the world have heard me speak. Incredible, like that blows my mind more than anybody. There's people all over the world that have heard of me. I'm like, what? But it's because of the internet, it's because of podcasts, it's because somebody else wanted to hear me talk and like you're doing today.

And it goes out there and I'm like, wow, I never thought I'd have any influence like this. And here I am, I guess I can potentially influence somebody's future if they maybe pay attention and do the verification, right? So like, okay, well, that's kind of a cool thought. So I'm just gonna keep doing that for a while and see where that leads me. Oh, and I'll tell you what, I'm blown away. It led me to an opportunity in Bitcoin. I was really impressed when I heard Peter Dunworth talk about...

Jim (57:22.08)

His perspective on Bitcoin, but also what he's doing with a business he created called the Bitcoin advisor. He's based out of Australia And so I found his twitter feed and I noticed he was already following me I didn't even at the time didn't even know who he was, but I thought he was really smart And I was like wow, this guy's following me. Okay, that's cool. I'm gonna follow him back And like within two minutes he saw that I followed him back and he dm'd me yo bro. Thanks for following me back Uh, i've been a fan for a while and i'm like, holy shit

And that kind of stuff also blows my mind. It's very, very heartwarming. It's really amazing, the love that I've gotten back from people. So I said, hey, I'm going to Pacific Bitcoin. Are you gonna be there? And he was, yeah, this is great. Let's meet, let's hang out. We got to hang out a bunch of times. And both of us, it was our last night there and we went out to dinner and he didn't know this. And most people don't know this about me. But when I was in my 20s, I worked in the financial services industry. I had a securities license. I worked for a company that did a lot of...

uh... business plan we set up pension plans for people who are in play benefit plans we sold a lot of insurance and annuities and uh... week and because of that we ended up doing and advising a lot of people on personal estate planning and so at the big corner visor at little bit of shell for the company i'm now helping to represent what we do is our goals to get people's big one off exchanges and get it in the most secure custody way it possible so that they can always have it

and it will pass properly to their heirs. That last part is critical. A lot of people own Bitcoin, they know how to secure it, and it may not get to their heirs. I'm not gonna get into all the ways that happens, but there are potentially a lot of ways. And so one of the key things that we really focus on and try to help our clients implement is a proper estate plan that accounts for the Bitcoin that they have in a way that upon their passing,

it will move to their heirs, whoever they want, flawlessly, without the state getting in the way or anybody else getting in the way. And there is mechanisms that allow this to work really well. And I think we're the leader in this personally right now in the Bitcoin ecosystem. There are other people that do. And what we're doing is we're helping people set their Bitcoin up in collaborative custody multisig. And we're not the only ones that do it.

Jim (59:45.072)

But our approach with our estate planning coordination is definitely the only one I'm aware of that's really trying to help the individual make sure that their family gets their Bitcoin if something should happen to them, especially unexpectedly. And it's a touchy subject. People don't not wanna talk about dying and they certainly don't wanna talk about all the effort it takes to do a proper estate plan. But folks, if you're listening to me right now, if you don't even have at least a simple will, you pass away.

the government's gonna decide who gets your stuff. And that's the last person you want. You gotta go to, what is it called? The Court for Estates, I forget what it's called. But it's not, that's the one, thank you. That's not where you want your family to have to go to decide to, oh, and you know what they get to do? Because they're now in charge, they get to take a piece of your estate as a fee. So it's really horrible. If you do it correctly,

You can have 100% of your assets passed to your wife, your kids, whoever matters to you, but you have to take the time to do it because here's the thing. The Bitcoin protocol does not recognize court orders or anything else. And you have to deal with settling in a state in the real world. So there's the connection between real world assets and the Bitcoin network and the protocol. And unfortunately, the protocol only responds to...

valid signed transactions like at its base and Nothing outside the protocol can force the protocol to move the Bitcoin to wherever some judge says to go without the proper authority Which means you have to have control of the private keys and then you have to some human being this is again You're outside the protocol some human being has to act They have to sign a message the Bitcoin then moves on the protocol to the new address

and now somebody else controls it, hopefully the person you wanted to. And so a lot of people don't think about that part, the fact that the real world is involved when you pass your Bitcoin to somebody else, and you have to know what they're gonna do if you don't take action yourself. And you can, and you can fix it, you can make it work perfect if you take the time to set it up, and that's what we're helping people to do. So I am kind of, I'm still kinda pinching myself because for a long time I thought I would love to be in Bitcoin

Jim (01:02:11.568)

I would love for my job to be just education. Just talk, explain things, and make some money maybe. And in my real world, I have tools, I have workers, I have insurances, I have suppliers, and all, just so many moving parts. And in my Bitcoin job that I have now, I literally just have to talk, I have to have my brain working, hopefully that keeps going. But I could be anywhere.

I don't have to have workers comp or liability insurance. I mean, it changes the game like in an amazing amount of ways, I should say. And yeah, I am just kind of feeling pretty blessed that I not only found Bitcoin, I found so many awesome, awesome people in Bitcoin. And then a really cool guy from Australia gave me an opportunity to help really orange pillsome people and maybe help them secure generational wealth that they want to do because we have a really great system to do it. So

Yeah, thanks for letting me shill the company. I hope everybody books a call with me after they hear this and let's get you set up so your family gets your Bitcoin one day, because if you believe in generational wealth, then you better make sure you do it right, because the state is not gonna do what you want.

Brandon Gentile (01:03:24.036)

Absolutely, absolutely. All right, last thing here and we'll link to this stuff below as well And obviously if people can tell you're a wealth of knowledge, so they would be smart to set up a time to talk to you Absolutely a little word association game presented by Bitcoin trading cards So I'm gonna say got like a dozen words or so and I want you to just you know kind of lightning round go through them and What comes to your mind and we'll rock through here

Jim (01:03:34.821)

Thank you very much.

Jim (01:03:43.27)

Oh.

Jim (01:03:48.206)

Okay.

Jim (01:03:54.052)

Okay, do it. Illusive.

Brandon Gentile (01:03:54.413)

Freedom.

Jim (01:04:02.908)

Brilliant.

Jim (01:04:08.592)

Love.

Jim (01:04:17.2)

Hmm I get to meet my extended Bitcoin family. I couldn't do that in one word

Brandon Gentile (01:04:26.204)

I love that. That's perfect. Bitcoin maximalism or freedom maximalism?

Jim (01:04:35.61)

Siding with the truth.

Brandon Gentile (01:04:39.384)

of it. Volunteerism.

Jim (01:04:44.208)

Worth it.

Jim (01:04:52.266)

Aligning with nature's energy.

Brandon Gentile (01:04:59.97)

Citadel.

Jim (01:05:04.048)

hopefully a safe place.

Brandon Gentile (01:05:08.49)

family

Jim (01:05:13.02)

That's where it all starts. Very important.

Jim (01:05:21.356)

Unavoidable. They're everywhere. If you don't align with them, you're screwed.

Jim (01:05:30.148)

the healthiest diet on the planet.

Jim (01:05:37.228)

Oh, dirt, garbage.

Jim (01:05:46.48)

Um, hmm. Creativity, expression, shelter, home. It's a lot of things when you build a nice, a nice place for somebody. It brings a lot.

Brandon Gentile (01:06:02.404)

So cool. Bitcoin trading cards.

Jim (01:06:07.332)

Wow, that's a new one for me boy. I was never a trading card person, but I'm really getting into it now I mean, how can I not they made one of me but I'm loving this is a really this is much longer answer But I'm loving the community around this whole thing I was never much of a collector, but I really love the energy of the people in that space and I'm I actually Inadvertently decided I'll just grab some packs of cards here and there from the different conferences. I went to and I now have some

some scarce ones, but I've never opened any of them. So I've got the unopened packs from like Pacific Bitcoin and a couple others, and apparently they're worth a good amount of money, but I'm not in it for that. I just love the idea of being sort of part of the family maybe. Yeah, so that's a, yeah, you got me with that one. I need to really think, so I had to use a lot more words than just one or two.

Brandon Gentile (01:07:00.896)

Yeah, I love it. I love it. Lastly, the Bitcoin advisor.

Jim (01:07:05.824)

Uh oh. You're breaking up there. I missed what you just said. Sorry.

Brandon Gentile (01:07:11.474)

The last one, the Bitcoin advisor.

Jim (01:07:16.316)

Oh, pioneers. Man, we are going to set the standard for how to take care of your Bitcoin and not lose it. And I think we are pioneering an industry here and I'm really excited about it. Thank you.

Brandon Gentile (01:07:28.572)

I love it. Absolutely love it. Thank you so much for your time, Jim, and the time earlier, us troubleshooting things. Where can people find you? Yeah.

Jim (01:07:35.5)

Oh, that was fun. Easiest places on Twitter, SurferJimW on Twitter. And you can now email me directly, surferjim at the Bitcoin advisor, that's advisor with an ER at the end. If you're really interested in what we do, you can book a meeting on my calendar. I'm happy to talk with you about that and tell all your friends what we're doing, learn what we're doing. Don't trust Verify, like I always say. But I think if you look into what we're doing,

you'll find that we offer a really great service and we're gonna help a lot of people protect their Bitcoin. So I'm really motivated for that. And I feel like it's a noble occupation to be in. So I'm really, really happy I found something that I could really stand behind. The product we sell, everybody needs essentially. So I feel really good about that. So thank you.

Brandon Gentile (01:08:25.324)

Noble is a great word and you've got a lot of fine people working there and what you guys are doing. So yeah, I Love what you're doing Yeah

Jim (01:08:30.42)

Yeah, we got it. We got it dude. We got an amazing crew and they keep adding Superstars to the lineup. It's incredible every week. They add more advisors from all over the world I mean we're growing by leaps and bounds and we are getting a ridiculous amount of people calling us and saying I gotta know more And so it's happening

Jim (01:09:02.313)

So it's really it's really great. It couldn't be more in alignment with who I am I don't want to go out there and shill a bunch of crap. I don't want to be looked at as some salesman, dude I'd rather be looked at as an educator and I'm trying to be that and The role that I have with the Bitcoin advisor fits perfectly because I'd never have to try I just answer their questions and they all go Oh, wow. Oh cool. Oh, yeah, you know a lot of a lot of those moments where that you know

Light bulb moments where people are like, oh, I didn't see it that way. Okay, cool. So I'm just loving it I really it couldn't be more better from more perfect for me. So I really appreciate dude. I really appreciate this I told you this before we went live. I think you do a great podcast I'd never expected you'd invite me on I don't think much about that stuff and then here we are today doing it And I'm really like I'm honored. I'm honored that you would ask me to come. Thank you really so much. It's been great

Brandon Gentile (01:09:55.104)

Absolutely. Your wealth and knowledge. And I look up to you, the wisdom you have, and as many do. I mean, shoot, you got, what, 20,000 people that think the same way on Twitter alone, on X alone. So, appreciate you. Thank you, Jim.

Jim (01:10:10.653)

Thanks. Thank you very much.

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